Need advice on a threat situation. - Kimber Forum

Kimber


Go Back   Kimber Forum > Off Topic Area > Off-Topic Discussion Forum

Like Tree2Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 03-28-2014, 11:39 AM   #1
Super Moderator
 
Chuck43's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Northern Illinois
Posts: 32,838
Need advice on a threat situation.

My son and daughter in law are both licensed to carrry in the state of Michigan. They have 4 young kids age 5, 7 and twins 9. My daughter in law was at the mall last Saturday shopping with the four kids, around 4:30 as she headed out into the parking lot to go home she encountered someone following her yelling and acting strangely. Without going into a long story mall security showed up and restrained the guy. She was armed with her 9mm but she never thought about it, her primary concern was the kids, they were all within 6' - 10' of her and her only concern was trying to gather them together. This drew her attention away from the threat, and left everyone open to attack. I know that what she did was wrong but I also think this was a natural reaction for a young mother. This was something they never considered happening and now that it has my son asked me what they could do to prevent something like this happening again. The first thing I thought of was to teach the kids to immediately without hesitating gather behind them when either of them yell a code word. I suggested they make a game of it and practice it at weird times during the day when the kids are least expecting it. I don't know if this is the right approach to the problem but I do know that they need something. I know we have a lot of parents, grandparents and both active and retired LEO's and military. Can anyone offer suggestions on how to train for or handle this type of threat?
__________________
WE DON'T SHOOT TO KILL, WE SHOOT TO SAVE A LIFE.
Chuck43 is online now   Reply With Quote
Remove Ads
Old 03-28-2014, 12:04 PM   #2
Senior Member
 
Insta-Gator's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Georgia
Posts: 11,763
Her reaction is completely understandable. The issue she had at the time was that the kids had no prior instruction on what to do in such situations. Your comments, IMO, are spot on. The children must be part of and involved in the family plan for emergencies. My SIL has been LEO for many years, from local PD to Secret Service. His concern was that someone he'd met during under cover work would recognize him. So, they all have a code word they use to initiate immediate action. No conversation, just action. It's tougher when some are very young, but part of the plan would be for the 9 y/o to assist in ensuring compliance with the plan. Once the code is given, the adult must focus on the threat and assume the plan is being implemented.

Glad everything worked out, this time.
MPO Southy likes this.
__________________
Insta-Gator aka .. Gary
(warning: prone to bouts of petulance)

It's not that I have something to hide, ... I have nothing I want you to see.

(remember your 4th Amendment right, people)
Insta-Gator is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-28-2014, 12:32 PM   #3
Senior Member
 
2sharp2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Chattanooga
Posts: 11,311
Originally Posted by Chuck43 View Post
My son and daughter in law are both licensed to carrry in the state of Michigan. They have 4 young kids age 5, 7 and twins 9. My daughter in law was at the mall last Saturday shopping with the four kids, around 4:30 as she headed out into the parking lot to go home she encountered someone following her yelling and acting strangely. Without going into a long story mall security showed up and restrained the guy. She was armed with her 9mm but she never thought about it, her primary concern was the kids, they were all within 6' - 10' of her and her only concern was trying to gather them together. This drew her attention away from the threat, and left everyone open to attack. I know that what she did was wrong but I also think this was a natural reaction for a young mother. This was something they never considered happening and now that it has my son asked me what they could do to prevent something like this happening again. The first thing I thought of was to teach the kids to immediately without hesitating gather behind them when either of them yell a code word. I suggested they make a game of it and practice it at weird times during the day when the kids are least expecting it. I don't know if this is the right approach to the problem but I do know that they need something. I know we have a lot of parents, grandparents and both active and retired LEO's and military. Can anyone offer suggestions on how to train for or handle this type of threat?
Interested in the response to this situation. Just my opinion but I think your first thought is pretty good but with a change or to. I would have the two older kids gather the two younger kids. Code word could work or the older kids are old enough to know when something crazy/dangerous is going down. Older kids get them all in moms car or at least behind cover away from mom while mom is moving and drawing her weapon. Six to ten feet is close enough Mom should have been more concerned, very surprised mall cops were that close and helpful. Lot of if's and what's and lot of ways that could have ended badly. Very happy that ended well.
My wife and I have talked about a few things like this, she does not carry. Her job is to distract (possibly tossing her purse away from us and not toward the bad guy) or just get in our car or some type of cover but for sure away from my position getting her phone and calling 911, because I will be moving/drawing my weapon and firing.
Maybe others have better tactical plans.
2sharp2 is offline   Reply With Quote
 
Old 03-28-2014, 12:42 PM   #4
Senior Member
 
Chuck66's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 451
Glad everyone is ok. Her reaction is completely understandable. I think your ideas are good but as you said they take practice.
Chuck66 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-29-2014, 05:22 AM   #5
Senior Member
 
bigdog10's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: central NY
Posts: 1,831
Chuck I think that your daughter in law may need more training along with the kids. gathering up the children only puts everyone in harms way. thank god your family is fine and everything worked out ok.
bigdog10 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-29-2014, 07:12 AM   #6
Senior Member
 
Fleamac's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Treehouse in Michigan
Posts: 165
Glad it didn't get worse than you stated. I've been thinking about getting a code word 'thing' going for my family. I don't want to have to worry about where they are if I need to address/focus on a serious threat. But I have another thought. She's carrying in a mall, is that mall a 'no guns allowed' place? Most are. If she's 'made' for carrying, it's not too bad. If she knowingly ignores their posting she's guilty of criminal trespass. Here's a list for you to pass on to your kids Chuck. MCRGO - Do Not Patronize while Armed Hope she's not too stressed over this. How long will it be till she goes back there?
Fleamac is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-29-2014, 07:25 AM   #7
Super Moderator
 
Chuck43's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Northern Illinois
Posts: 32,838
Originally Posted by bigdog10 View Post
Chuck I think that your daughter in law may need more training along with the kids. gathering up the children only puts everyone in harms way. thank god your family is fine and everything worked out ok.
George, more training is exactly what the family thinks. The kids are a little young and you never know if they'll all be together or where they'll be so I thought it would be easier for everyone to remember to just get behind mom or dad. I really don't know so the first thing I thought to do was to ask here and see if any of our members have already crossed this road.
bigdog10 likes this.
__________________
WE DON'T SHOOT TO KILL, WE SHOOT TO SAVE A LIFE.
Chuck43 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-29-2014, 07:29 AM   #8
Senior Member
 
Insta-Gator's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Georgia
Posts: 11,763
Originally Posted by Fleamac View Post
Glad it didn't get worse than you stated. I've been thinking about getting a code word 'thing' going for my family. I don't want to have to worry about where they are if I need to address/focus on a serious threat. But I have another thought. She's carrying in a mall, is that mall a 'no guns allowed' place? Most are. If she's 'made' for carrying, it's not too bad. If she knowingly ignores their posting she's guilty of criminal trespass. Here's a list for you to pass on to your kids Chuck. MCRGO - Do Not Patronize while Armed Hope she's not too stressed over this. How long will it be till she goes back there?
Boy, are you living in the wrong state. Shopping centers and their parking lots are where EVERYONE should be carrying for personal protection.
__________________
Insta-Gator aka .. Gary
(warning: prone to bouts of petulance)

It's not that I have something to hide, ... I have nothing I want you to see.

(remember your 4th Amendment right, people)
Insta-Gator is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-29-2014, 07:44 AM   #9
Super Moderator
 
Chuck43's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Northern Illinois
Posts: 32,838
Originally Posted by Fleamac View Post
Glad it didn't get worse than you stated. I've been thinking about getting a code word 'thing' going for my family. I don't want to have to worry about where they are if I need to address/focus on a serious threat. But I have another thought. She's carrying in a mall, is that mall a 'no guns allowed' place? Most are. If she's 'made' for carrying, it's not too bad. If she knowingly ignores their posting she's guilty of criminal trespass. Here's a list for you to pass on to your kids Chuck. MCRGO - Do Not Patronize while Armed Hope she's not too stressed over this. How long will it be till she goes back there?
Thanks for the list, I'll pass it on to them. I don't know where she was at, they live in a small town in semi rural Michigan. I doubt she would knowingly patronize a business that was posted, as for the stress thing, she's a high school English teacher LOL.
__________________
WE DON'T SHOOT TO KILL, WE SHOOT TO SAVE A LIFE.
Chuck43 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-29-2014, 08:48 AM   #10
Senior Member
 
Marshall's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Cardinal Nation
Posts: 19,290
Originally Posted by Fleamac View Post
If she knowingly ignores their posting she's guilty of criminal trespass. Here's a list for you to pass on to your kids Chuck. MCRGO - Do Not Patronize while Armed Hope she's not too stressed over this. How long will it be till she goes back there?
Chuck,I'm glad everyone is alright this time. That's one of the problems with the "No firearm"signs posted everywhere. The criminals can have a field day because most people are unarmed in establishments like the mall because of the "where you can carry"laws. I know your son and his family will come up with a plan..
Marshall is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Buying a solo and need sme advice sentinel09 Kimber Solo Forum 22 03-12-2014 10:37 PM
Help & Advice on Kimber 1911's Mydogmax Kimber 1911 Forum 8 01-12-2014 06:14 PM
Would like some advice Nalgi Kimber 1911 Forum 2 03-07-2013 03:06 AM