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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Czech this out. Today while out picking up some materials for a project, I stopped in an LGS I hadn't been to before. I've read a few positive reviews and comments from IPSC competitors who give a thumbs up to SAR but never saw one up close. Nicely done Turkish CZ 75 clone, purpose-built for competition shooting on a budget. It almost followed me home. I decided to sleep on it. I rarely buy a pistol without shooting it first. This shop had no range so that wasn't an option. The price in relation to the build quality of this pistol is very good.

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So how much are the K12’s? It has to much writing and logos, numbers on it for my taste.

I think I would lay my money on a Wilson Combat EDC X9 instead.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
So how much are the K12’s? It has to much writing and logos, numbers on it for my taste.

I think I would lay my money on a Wilson Combat EDC X9 instead.
600 bucks. I'm with you on the wordy grips. The rest doesn't really bother me. The grips are easy and inexpensive to change. It's a 9mm CZ 75 Tac Sport clone, 4.7 inch barrel. not a 1911. Whole 'nuther animal from the Wilson, which is a nice piece. This is a target pistol. I dont think anyone would carry it. Heavy as Hell.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Honest Outlaw did a review on one a while back. I will refrain from comment as I have never had one. Almost bought one several times though.

Honest review. Overall positive. I agree on the grips and the sights. I cant comment on the trigger since I haven't shot one. But at $600 bucks, that's a hard to pass up deal. One third the cost of a CZ 75 Sport Tac and "almost" as good. I can probably live with almost.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 · (Edited)
There's a new Turk in town. His name is Sarsilmaz. A steal at $610 plus the Governor's pound of flesh. Range day is tomorrow. I rolled the dice and bought it without shooting one first. I traded in a Ruger Mk III I haven't shot in ages to knock down how much cash I had to lay down.

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Honest review. Overall positive. I agree on the grips and the sights. I cant comment on the trigger since I haven't shot one. But at $600 bucks, that's a hard to pass up deal. One third the cost of a CZ 75 Sport Tac and "almost" as good. I can probably live with almost.
I share in that opinion. This post made me consider it again. Still not ready yet. My 9mm full size Stainless Raptor II was supposed to be here today but didn’t show. Now I’m itching… I need to make that Raptor the last one for a while. Get all the gun reviews done for the ones I have already and the breakin done for all of them. I have like 7 or 8 ARs that have never been fired. 3 shotguns that have never been fired. 8k rounds that need loaded. Last thing I need is another gun to catch my attention.

All that said, I put a Rapide Dawn 45 in my cart. A Stainless Raptor 45 in my cart. Two 12” 45 Colt Buntlines and that K-12 in there. In each case, I almost checked out but haven’t yet. I keep telling myself the above…
 

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There's a new Turk in town. His name is Sarsilmaz. A steal at $610 plus the Governor's pound of flesh. Range day is tomorrow. I rolled the dice and bought it without shooting one first. I traded in a Ruger Mk III I haven't shot in ages to knock down how much cash I had to lay down.

View attachment 131888

That's a great price.
I would have jumped on it too.
You did good.
 
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Discussion Starter · #13 · (Edited)
Saturday is outdoor range day for the new SAR and couple others

I called today to ask which RO was working tomorrow. One of them has a disagreement with me about what constitutes rapid fire. I always do a series of drills when shooting pistols. Among those is what I would describe as a double tap. From the draw, two quick shots. Speed is the whole point of the drill. They know me well and I'm allowed to draw from the holster if the lanes near me are open. But this one guy really pisses me off, micromanaging everybody on the range. I asked him if he was the president of his HOA. The type that carries a clipboard and measures the height of people's mailboxes and shrubs, noting violations. I'm all about safety and discipline, but nitpicky rule makers and I don't get along. In any aspect of life. I can outshoot this guy blindfolded and standing on one leg. Maybe that's what is stuck in his craw. Or somewhere further south.

I packed my range bag tonight and decided to take the Tanfoglio and a P220 with me as well. It's been a while since I shot the Sig. It will be fun re-acclimating to it and also breaking in the Witness and the SAR. The reason I decided to bring the P220 is I stumbled across the Hickok45 review of it yesterday and was reminded of how much I liked it. So I dug it out of the safe.

My range report on the SAR and Tanfoglio is probably going to be Sunday.
 

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So how much are the K12’s? It has to much writing and logos, numbers on it for my taste.

I think I would lay my money on a Wilson Combat EDC X9 instead.
It has the company name, model number, and serial number???? How is that too much? Wilson Combat X9 and most handguns have the same information on them. The only difference is that many foreign handgun manufacturers serialize the frame, barrel, and slide with matching numbers which IMHO, is a good thing.

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The K12's can be found for under $700 (closer to $600) regularly. A lot of gun for the money especially compared to the $2000-$3000 handguns others are bringing up.
 

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Ok you like it...I don't.
 
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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Precedent: Grip Zone. Seemed silly. Some marketing wonk thought that sounded cool. But after a while, I paid no attention to the words on a Springfield XD/s.

My assumption is that the newly formed SAR USA is making a big effort to gain some brand recognition. I've already ordered LOK Thin Bogie G10 grips for it. Logo free.

True that all major parts are serialized and matched on the SAR K12.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
It has the company name, model number, and serial number???? How is that too much? Wilson Combat X9 and most handguns have the same information on them. The only difference is that many foreign handgun manufacturers serialize the frame, barrel, and slide with matching numbers which IMHO, is a good thing.

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The K12's can be found for under $700 (closer to $600) regularly. A lot of gun for the money especially compared to the $2000-$3000 handguns others are bringing up.
I'm anxious to compare the SAR with the Tanfoglio. They are very similar in all respects. Size, weight, etc. I got a great deal on both but paid more for the Italian. The triggers are not as good as my former CZ 75, but it's close enough. Both average 3.5 lbs and the reset isn't too bad. The bow on the SAR trigger is odd but it doesn't bother me.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 · (Edited)
Range Report

SAR K12 Sport


A sunny, steamy day at the range with a new Sarsilmarz. I was very impressed with how well this pistol is put together. It shoots super flat, thanks to the sheer heft of the frame and slide. The trigger was good. Way better than I expected after doing some dry firing.

I put it through its paces using a mixed bag of factory 9 mm ammo. I stuck with FMJ since I have no desire to carry this pistol. It ran perfectly. No break-in period to marry the slide to the frame seems needed. It ran reliably from the first shot fired. Zero FTF or FTE incidents out of the box.

It’s well balanced and the grip is comfortable. Five-shot groups fired at 25 yards nearly all stayed under 3 inches with an average spread of 2-3/4. Not bad. At 50 yards I was able to keep two 17-round mags within the black on a B-6 NRA target. All total, 200 rounds thru it today.

General comments? I’d like it more if it had better sights. Besides switching to LOK G10 grips, it needs an upgrade on the sights. This is a very capable and affordable target/race gun. Someone who practiced enough could compete on a level playing field with others shooting much more expensive pistols.

The K12 Sport is not something I would ever want to carry. There’s no rail or any of the features you might want for a home defense pistol either. As the name implies, it is a sporting pistol.

Tanfoglio Witness

I was having so much fun with the SAR K12 that I became a little fatigued after 200 rounds. But I put 100 thru the Witness anyway. My accuracy was not quite as good as with the SAR but that was me, not the gun. It was hotter than Hades and I was sweating like a racehorse after an hour but I hung in there.

Recoil/muzzle flip is barely noticeable. At 25 yards I was able to put all but four rounds from two 17-round mags into a 4 inch ragged hole. But wrapping up my session at 50 yards, my concentration and aim were fading and I was having a hard time achieving an eight-inch spread. So I hung it up and headed home.

The Witness is a lot like the SAR. Heavy but very well balanced. The wood factory grips are better than the SAR grips. Nicely textured, but I will still replace them with a set of LOK G10 thin grips. I have average-sized hands but I prefer very thin grips on pistols…. a habit I developed playing baseball. I had the same preference for thin-handled bats like hall of fame hitter Stan Musial.

The Witness trigger is a tiny bit better on the reset than the SAR, but not enough to make a big difference. The factory sights are better than the SAR also but they are nothing to rave about. I’ll reserve my suspicion on the Tanfo sights are misaligned slightly left until I check it. As I mentioned, I was getting fatigued in my second hour at an outdoor range. The noon/early afternoon sun had also become unfavorable.

This was the second time I shot this pistol and as with the first, it ran like was dipped in butter. Surprising for a gun that appears to have pretty tight tolerances. No slop in the slide whatsoever. I ran the same types of FMJs of various makes and weights I fed the SAR and in no particular order. It ate everything. Tanfoglio obviously has some good machines and machinists. Not a big surprise since they are made in the same province as Beretta’s HQ.

Bottom line: The Tanfoglio Witness is a pretty awesome full-size pistol for the money. But like the SAR, it’s principally a target/race gun. With a decent mag well extension and better sights, a skilled competitor also could do well with this gun. Is it better than much higher-priced target/race guns? No. But it is definitely good enough.

Never got to shoot the P220 I also brought with me.
 
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